There is only ONE Oklahoma

Saturday, September 09, 2006

Just stick your head in the sand part II

So in part one of the multi part rant, we saw the 'public' defleption and even attempt to cover up legitimate questions concerning the imfamous auction. From ignored questions, to locked threads.

So there was little choice but to contact the Spin Master directly and ask the questions that needed to be asked. After just a little research of Foundations, 3rd party charity fund raising, and even Virginia State Law, the following email was sent to WEBMASTER of the Sadler Fan Club as per Brett's instructions.

The following email was sent on Tue, 21 Mar 2006:


There are always easy ways to do things, and there are hard ways. Your decision to ignore and deflect attention to questions posted and via email have left no other choice but to pursue the matter further concerning the Ebay auction of item 8770898404 and its anomalies. The questions previously asked were not abnormal questions and in fact came from a Federal Trade Commission’s report concerning their warnings of potential charity scams by third parties.

Concerning the auction itself.

Pursuant to Ebay policy with items where a portion of the proceeds will go directly to a charitable organization and pursuant to Virginia State Law, the following questions are posed.
1) Since we all now know the final selling price the item ($820) what is the exact ‘portion’ of this amount going to the Elliott and Hermie Sadler Foundation? I site Ebay’s policy and guidelines concerning fundraising:
Guidelines for non-eBay Giving Works charity listings
Sellers may only list items for charity without eBay Giving Works if they:
· Are soliciting on behalf of recognized tax-deductible charitable organizations (for example, 501(c)(3) status or equivalent with the IRS).
· Receive advance written consent for the solicitation from the benefiting nonprofit.

To verify you received permission, you must include a scanned copy of the consent in your listing. It must appear with the nonprofit’s letterhead, signed by an officer and include the nonprofit’s tax-deductibility status as well as your name or eBay User ID, dates of event/listings, and donation amount (percentage of the final sale price).

2) Because the Elliott and Hermie Sadler Foundation is a registered 501(c) 3 organization with a NTEE Code of T-30, what did you as the seller place as the ‘reasonable value’ of the item 8770898404 before the auction was made public?

3) “Shill bidding” is a very serious crime, especially in the Sports Memorabilia Industry and has been prosecuted by State Attorney Generals on numerous occasions. The identity of bidder ID “spotter38” has been traced and connected to the seller’s ID. This is a blatant and obvious violation of Ebay policy as well as Federal law. Are you prepared to compensate the amounts shill bided to the eventual winner of the auction? This becomes a credibility issue and buyer confidence issue and something that should not be taken lightly.

4) Virginia State Law requires that all "Charitable sales promotions" (see § 57-48. Definitions of Virginia State Code) and a “Commercial co-venturer” (in this case “Driver’s Sports Motorsports Marketing”) that contract and agreement information is to be filed and become public record to the Commissioner of Agriculture and Consumer Services Division of the State of Virginia. Has this been completed? And what is the official IRS status of “Driver’s Sports Motorsports Marketing”? (a Sole Proprietor, Partnership, Limited Liability Company/Partnership (LLC/LLP), Corporation, Subchapter S Corporation)

Concerning the Elliott and Hermie Sadler Foundation

It was previously asked and ignored (in spite of the remark concerning 'fan support') concerning the Mission Statement, the Foundation’s 501(c)3 status, and other serious and legal questions, the following is formally being asked to be made available.

1) A list of the Board of Directors or officials and their contact information and future scheduled meeting dates.
2) The Foundation’s Mission Statement and the specific programs the foundation has supported in the past 3 fiscal years
3) As pursuant to Federal Statue section 6104(e) of the Internal Revenue Code, please provide the most recent ‘Form 990’ including the Schedule “A” attachment along with any other supporting documentation for the past three years filed, specific disclosure of support documentation of line ‘14 of the Form 990’. This will also be asked after the filing deadline of May 15, 2006 for the 2005 taxable year, if not included in this request.
4) A copy of the Foundation’s latest annual report.
If the requested information can’t be returned electronically, a physical address of an organization/watchdog group that monitors activities such as this will be provided.
It is unfortunate that because of the actions of the powers that be this had to come to such an extreme situation. In this day an age with the Sarbanes-Oxley Act, which is the vehicle, state governments are holding even nonprofits to higher accounting standards. Compounding the fact that this is not the first time this foundation has benefited from Ebay Auctions over the past 3 years, it appears that you simply are wanting potential bidders/buyers of items offered by Driver’s Sports Motorsports Marketing to simply take your word and turn a blind eye to potential legal issues and implications that may arise. It is foolish to donate any amount of money or bid on a charity item without having questions directly answered in a forth coming and open manner. Not only have you failed to do this, you have opened up possible suspicion and skepticism of the motives of Driver’s Sports Motorsports Marketing as a whole.
In accordance with Federal Statue section 6104(e) of the Internal Revenue Code, and the Federal Trade Commissions guidelines, your response is pending.

Thank you for your time.

While on the surface this lengthly information request might seem un-needed, but when people use the ruse of 'a portion while go to charity' in order to profit from it, then questions like this will be asked. What is sad, is that I know that the Sadler's don't need the money, and neither does Brett, and we are only talking about a few hundred dollars. And the majority of the questions I asked, with just a little research, I already knew the answers, (for instance, electronic copies of the Foundations Federal tax forms, the Form 990 are public record) the real test was to see if Brett would answer them. Brett's direct response speaks volumes.

To be continued......


Anonymous said...

Sadler's don't need the money.

Brett doesn't even need the money.

Why would they do it?

Anonymous said...

Because they are arrogant, and don't think of long-term repercussions.

Anonymous said...

My personal opinin is that pride got involved. What little interaction I've had with Brett he comes across as a country boy who's head has been turned by "the good life" he's been able to live by being employed by Elliott. When you start to think that you are wonderful and everything you do is right then it's hard to eat humble pie and admit that you made a major mistake, i.e. the manner the eBay auction was conducted. All they needed to do was retract the auction and start over after getting all their info lined up as to what the requirements were for eBay. No harm no foul. But Brett seemed to take any and all questions as a questioning of his personal integrity which it wasn't. They just didn't know enough to conduct the auction in an appropriate and above board manner. It seems that there is a lot of paperwork invovled, so maybe Brett just wanted to overlook it because all that hard work would take away from his party time at the strip clubs with Elliott. Time for Elliott to get a business manager who keeps an office other than in the motorcoach lot with him or on his plane with him.

Anonymous said...

How do you people know so much? Even about Brett in your Blog, quoting that Brett doesn't need the money.

Or that he hangs in strip clubs with Elliott or his office is Elliott's motorhome, plane.

Elliott makes him decisions good or bad, why does it matter??

Anonymous said...

Why all the bashing of Elliott or Brett?

I'm not sure what your trying to accomplish. What if you lived your life in the public eye?

Anonymous said...


Fraud is a better word. It fits Sadler well.

Anonymous said...

Why all the bashing of Elliott or Brett?

I'm not sure what your trying to accomplish. What if you lived your life in the public eye?

I would expect to have my actions scrutinized as to whether they were legal or not. This isn't exactly an abnormally high standard. Some of us do expect it from famous and non-famous people alike.

Anonymous said...

Bashing??? I don't think discussing highly suspicious, seemingly illegal activities is bashing.

Bottom line: he's a public figure, and "he's entitled to a life!" or not, he has standards to uphold. Whether he wants to be or not, he is a role model. And not any of his behavior this year especially has been role model worthy. Not to mention he is required to follow laws, and the ebay auction is highly suspect and only made to look worse by how Brett and company handled it.

Seems to me like women and money and booze are the name of the game for Sadler these days instead of being a good, nice person to all of his fans (MySpace pretty much proved to me that the fans come last and the 'ladies' and 'benjamins' and booze come first). Shame, and hopefully more of the "true fans" will grow out of the ostrich syndrome before they get more attached to the guy and then they end up upset by his antics too. Bottom line for me is, he apparently is nothing like he portrayed himself to be. And that is truly a disappointment to this former "real" fan.

Anonymous said...

You know from the way the Sadlers have been acting lately, I wonder if they do NEED THE MONEY! Heck, everything they do is a money grab.

Elliott and Hermie's latest "faux pas" in my book was that little Barn Party blurb on Raceday segment, where they said they do this every year (wrong) and that this year they had to do it for their 'REAL FANS', felt like my face was slapped! Fans are fans, there are no "true", no "real", no "huge" fans! No "longest", "smallest" "biggest" .....well you get the drift. They are FANS, and the fans are who keep you in the spotlight, who keep you in the money, who keep you from fading into oblivion. Treat them all the same!!

Now onto Brett the genius: What exactly are the qualifications for a Business Manager? Well, in everyday life I would say the person would be smart, they would know a little about marketing, a little about Public Relations, a little about handling money, and be pretty good with the english language and it's composition.

Now in Bretts case,his qualifications would be: How to hose people for money, How to cheat on your wife, How to not answer perfectly legimate questions, How to drink really well, How to get Ho's for himself and Elliott, How to NOT set up a myspace account properly, How to not speak or write in grammatically correct english. The man is a waste of space, did he finish school?, is he Elliotts business manager simply on the basis of being his childhood buddy?

Seems to me Brett has taken his ego to the limit, he can hang with Elliott and pick up his cast-offs.
His kind of business manager, is not one I would like to have, he does nothing for the person he works for, except make him look more suspicious, by not answering questions posed to him, in a perfectly proper manner.(a function of a business manager) Brett is a hanger-on'er, he will be there until the glory dries up(which I don't think is far off), Brett has his head so far up Elliotts butt, all you can see are his shoelaces!! (tight fit, maybe, maybe not) Now, Hermie isn't much better IMO, it appears that they are all in the secret society of IDIOTS!

Now I don't see any bashing of Brett or anyone else, all of what has been stated in true in fact, and if you have a problem with people stating their opinions or going off on the "private lives" or "public eye" stuff, then you need to get a grip.
This says it perfectly:

[b]Bottom line: he's a public figure, and "he's entitled to a life!" or not, he has standards to uphold. Whether he wants to be or not, he is a role model. And not any of his behavior this year especially has been role model worthy. Not to mention he is required to follow laws, and the ebay auction is highly suspect and only made to look worse by how Brett and company handled it.[/b]

and really Brett in his role as business manager, should have known better, but then again he was the one "shill" bidding.

Mama Bell, stated yesterday on the segment about the Barn Party that "she was wholly responsible for these two" (meaning Elliott and Hermie), now that is something to be REALLY PROUD OF.........I wouldn't have said that on National TV.....the poor woman.

Note to Brett: since I am sure you are one of the anonymous people, Time to grow up buddy boy, time to take responsibility for your actions, this ain't high school anymore, these people are smart and want answers, isn't it about time you get your ego in check and do your job - properly!!

and Phil I await the next installment, as I am sure it is quite similar (grammatically at least) to what I have received from the Joker.

Dodge said...

The Sadler Fan Club seems to have over grown its current staff. They do nothing on a yearly basis it would appear. I mean there is only so much a person's family can do.

And by the way, why is there nothing on the fan club website about the Sadler Foundation?? Not a link, not a blurb, not a mention. Nothing. If you go to the foundation website all the links will do is redirect you to the fan club site. Which has no info. Not even an update on how much money was raised at the barn party.

Anonymous said...

Not even an update on how much money was raised at the barn party.

30,000 we all know that.. just let it all go... sheesh

Anonymous said...

Dodge, I have one word for you.....


Anonymous said...

30,000 we all know that.. just let it all go... sheesh

I do believe the request was to have it posted somewhere on the website's link to the Foundation. After all, last spring the Sadlers were supposed to have a page or a site up about the foundation.I see that nothing has been done about that.

Go to most of the other drivers websites. They have their charity links prominently displayed. There is no reason for the Sadlers to not do the same, unless they don't want us to know or have access to what they actually are doing with the money. Or, they may be lazy, which in itself shows a lack of business acumen.

Frankly, I don't see where anyone needs to let this go, unless you are busy standing in line drinking the grape kool-aid! At least take the time to read what went on, take the time to think about it, and take the time to ask questions of the Sadler foundation yourself.

Being any kind of a fan does not mean you have to be a blind fan.

Anonymous said...

Frankly, I don't see where anyone needs to let this go, unless you are busy standing in line drinking the grape kool-aid!

Thanks but my Kool aid is not grape its Cherry and I dont see where Kool aid has one thing to do with it either your a fan or your not plain and simple

Julie said...

LOL, I'll line up in the "NOT" line, I simply don't downshift that far, nor do I stoop that low.

You make it sound like not being a fan is something to be ashamed of. In fact, NOT being a fan is something we (my family) are PROUD of. We've sat down, talked about it, and decided where we stand: we deserve better. But I will say, it is very gratifying to see others who are also upset by the same B.S. which got under our skin and caused us to move on to drivers who behave more reputably.


Anonymous said...

I dont see where Kool aid has one thing to do with it

How in the heck does someone grow up without knowing history and the significance 'standing in line to drink grape kool-aid?'

No, there is no black or white here, lots of shades of gray. I like my driver, but I don't like that he did this or that. I don't like THAT driver, but boy can he drive.

Opening your mind can be a great experience. Idolizing anyone will cause you to be disappointed.

Dodge said...

I have not seen anything official put out by the Sadlers on the $30,000 that was supposedly raised for the foundation. I've only seen it discussed in various other forums by people "who know". I did not know that the Barn party was a fundraising opportunity as that was not advertised. It was advertised as a day to get together with other fans, look at Elliott's dogs, eat bologna, and apparently from what other bloggers who attended the party drink all the beer you wanted to as long as you brought it in yourself and told the guy at the gate it was water.

My point is that if it was a fundraiser, they never bothered to advertise that nor have they release official information regarding the amount raised. The information that I have read, and it's all been 3rd hand info, has been from a moderator at the SFC message board. She is not, to my knowledge, a paid employee of the Sadlers unless they have started paying the board mods. Nor is she a paid member of Elliott's PR staff.

Anonymous said...

Since you are now in the public eye you need to be careful about who you are saying is doing something illegal. It is illegal to take pictures off nascar.com, alter them and post them elsewhere on the internet without their permission. Whoops!!!!!! You aren't doing so good in the public eye are you?
Maybe you should quit pointing your finger at others' faults and take a look in the mirror.

Anonymous said...

Its called "FARK"ing, and there are many sight dedicated to this art.
http://www.fark.com/ for instance

The Supreme Court has deemed this as SATIRE, not copyright infringement.

I have seen these pics were from the Porn Queen's site, I am sure you know where that is. (the good ole, 'daily drool' thread) Maybe you should talk to her about it.

Frankly, if that is all you can come up with, it really shows just how far some will reach to blindly support their driver. Have another glass of kool-aid!

Anonymous said...

Gee, I wonder what this means then?
(B) NASCAR.COM contains copyrighted material, trademarks and other proprietary information, including, but not limited to, text, software, photos, video, graphics, music and sound, and the entire contents of NASCAR.COM are copyrighted as a collective work under the United States copyright laws. NASCAR and TSI own a copyright in the selection, coordination, arrangement and enhancement of such content, as well as in the content original to it. Subscriber may not modify, publish, transmit, participate in the transfer or sale, create derivative works, or in any way exploit, any of the content, in whole or in part. Subscriber may download copyrighted material for Subscriber's personal use only. Except as otherwise expressly permitted under copyright law, no copying, redistribution, retransmission, publication or commercial exploitation of downloaded material will be permitted without the express permission of TSI and the copyright owner. In the event of any permitted copying, redistribution or publication of copyrighted material, no changes in or deletion of author attribution, trademark legend or copyright notice shall be made. Subscriber acknowledges that it does not acquire any ownership rights by downloading copyrighted material.

okla21fan said...

Anonymous said...
It is illegal to take pictures off nascar.com, alter them and post them elsewhere on the internet without their permission.

The Hustler Vs Fallwell Supreme Court decision in 1998 set precidence and said that satire, even satire which uses a photograph of which the satarist is not the copyright owner, is constitutionally protected free speech under the first ammendment and if farking isn't satire then nothing is satire.

here is a link to the decision:

The "education" of the Sadler faithful continues

BTW, you are really going to hate my next blog early next week then. ;)

Marla said...

Wow, there are some mightily irritated folks here. I wonder about the 'attorney' on the other board, and what she would say about it. Of course, since so many here refuse to post their handles or emails, ..... you never know Phil...the attorney may be HERE!

Anonymous said...

You are wrong about anyone hating the stuff you print here. The only thing I can surmise from reading all your little stories is that you are angry about some auction that you lost on ebay and have decided to get revenge for it. You've tried to get everyone on your bandwagon and so far you have failed miserably. The thing about revenge is that it will eat you up and ruin your life. The best advice is to let it go and get on with your life because you will be the one that suffers the most from your little prank.

Anonymous said...

It might help for you to actually READ what is in the articles. Then, you would not have to 'surmise' anything, and you would find that your GUESS was wrong.